Quote: JohnnyD @ May 22, 2007, 12:05 PM

I don't think some people here have any idea what BBC Writersroom is for. A comedy submission to Writersroom has NEVER been commissioned. It is for 'promoting' talented writers - giving feedback, placing in workshops, ...

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This may all be true, but not always what the BBC has said or implied. The big issue, I think, is that for previously uncommissioned writers with no product "out there", there aren't many options of where else to go. Hence there is (justifiable in my opinion) discontent at a process which enables some inexperienced writers to go straight through to development when everyone else is forced to buy a Lotto ticket to get some "feedback" or a workshop place.

Btw, I haven't seen Gavin and Stacey, but this thread is a cracker.

I agree that its unfair that the writers seem to have had a much easier ride because of their status than other first time writers, but that this kind of thing is unavoidable and occurs in all trades. If you know people, or have some industry cache attached to you, then of course doors are going to open much easier than for the likes of us. Like I said, its unfair, unfortunate, but a sad fact of life. And I dont think that there is one of us on here who would not exploit contacts/industry friends/our position to help get something commisioned. That is if any of us had any contacts/industry friends or position!!!

I can't see what's lazy in the writing. I don't think a cast of such quality would attach themselves to gavin and stacey if tthey agreed. So i'm sticking with Alison Steadman, Julia Davis, Mathew Horne, Rob Brydon and Matt Lucas. Comedy of the week again in radio times as well.

Well Matt Horne was in Roman's Empire and Rob Brydon is in Annually Retentive...so saying the cast wouldn't be involved in something rubbish is not strictly true.

Just saw the first two and found it very enjoyable thought the big fellow played his role very well. Felt more like a comedy drama than a sitcom to me.

But very pleasant, couldn’t see much wrong with the script and the production and cast were top notch. Mind you I try not to over analyse these things, it take all the enjoyment out.

Ok, point taken. I stand corrected. Romans Empire IS dreadful, Annually retentive is like watching memento the right way round! Terrible terrible shows. Gavin and Stacey though has still attracted a steller cast none the less.

Josh - thanks for the wink - i'm glad that we can talk about it without getting on high horses.

Matt, you're a star, and when you're up there, I'll be tapping you as a contact, that's if you'll be answering my emails then.

Just watched episode 4 of Gavin and Stacey online and it really had me in stitches. Are you a friend of Matt Hornes slag? If so that's awesome!

Like any other business, you have to use who you know to some extent.

I work in radio, and jobs are not really advertised. I just get offered stuff.

Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 22, 2007, 7:24 PM

Not finding something funny, or not liking a show, I dont believe makes the writing automatically 'lazy'. Its a good show, not amazing, but very good, and I think that its detractors on here who keep saying that the writing is lazy as one of the reasons for not liking it is lazy in itself. It doesnt flick your switch, which is fair enough, but that doesnt make a show lazy, just not your cup of tea.

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I didn't say it was lazy because I didn't like it. The reason I didn't like it is because it's poorly scripted. That the only reason. I actually really like Matt Horne and larry lamb and Alison Steadman. If you go through the posts you'll see that I actually praised some of the writing (the route-planning scene with Rob Bryden).

The fact that the first episode was written in 24 hours is in itself an indication of the first-draft quality. In fact, if that statement is true, the first episode IS a first draft.

Further proof is indicated by some of the lines:

SMITHY:
Don't get overexcited, you know what happens to people who get overexcited?

GAVIN:
What?

SMITHY:
Nevermind.

He then goes on to talk about something else.

&

COACH DRIVER:
Fags and weed, glue and speed. But I draw the line at crack – that way everyone knows where they stand.

STACEY:
Aw, fair play.

This sentence doesn't really make any sense. Why does everyone know where they stand because he draws the line at crack? It is clearly not widely known what the driver's policy is because Stacey knows him well but she still asks if she can smoke a cigarette on the coach. It's just limp writing.

A BETTER VERSION MIGHT BE:

COACH DRIVER:
Fags and weed, glue and speed. But I draw the line at freebasin' as I 'aven't got a fire extinguisher.

You may find that miserably unfunny. But it IS a joke. The first one isn't.

Don't quit the day job Godot!

Quote: Josh Dulaney @ May 23, 2007, 10:52 PM

Don't quit the day job Godot!

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Ouch.

Quote: Badge @ May 22, 2007, 7:34 PM

This may all be true, but not always what the BBC has said or implied. The big issue, I think, is that for previously uncommissioned writers with no product "out there", there aren't many options of where else to go. Hence there is (justifiable in my opinion) discontent at a process which enables some inexperienced writers to go straight through to development when everyone else is forced to buy a Lotto ticket to get some "feedback" or a workshop place.

Btw, I haven't seen Gavin and Stacey, but this thread is a cracker.

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Badge, I couldn't agree more. The writersroom website goes to pains to tell you to not submit anything to any other department as it will just be returned there. I was told by an assistant producer that it was a bit hit and miss, which is certainly my experience. After telling me that my script would be above the standard of most of their submissions, it was returned unread.

I don't know how anyone can write a half hour comedy script in 24 hours. You need to put it away and then look at it with fresh eyes.

The 'world wide web' joke, to me, summed up the show. They knew they had to make the scene funny, they put something down and had Matthew Horne do a few facial expressions. If you want to write a top sitcom you've got to work at that scene and also ask why is he over there in the first place?

I think you're right. To me, the finished script of episode one is the sort of thing I would put into development. Say, this could work – put in a few jokes, think about the characters – why for example is 26 year old office worker Stacey's best friend a 40 year old woman who works in a coin arcade etc., and come back.

Eric Chapel says a half hour script should take about two and a half weeks, in his book. I don't think he's a particularly good writer, but he's written a lot of scripts under commission, so it must be a fair assessment.

The 24 hours story may not be true anyway, there're a lot of lies told in publicity.

Hmmm... I would have thought '24 hours' was merely a bit of spin too.

I'm not sure exactly how the whole commissioning/production system works but I'm guessing there are tight time (and budget, obviously) constraints on a show of this type which will mean even experienced writers have to let some things go.

It's a shame... but, unfortunately, a reality. As is the increased probability of known entities (Ruth & James for their acting to date) getting a shot at having a sitcom (sorry, comedy drama) commissioned and produced over a struggling unknown.