Quote: Renegade Carpark @ June 21 2012, 9:39 PM BST

I want to see the next generation of truly funny, intelligent, original and risk taking comedians. Michael McIntyre is only a major symptom of a wider disease - like the pneumonia that eventually kills the Aids patient.

My gut feeling - no proof mind - is that certain agents representing certain stars have far too much power over the comedy commissioning process. The commissioners on the other hand, are so shit scared of backing something unknown in case it fails, that they are more than happy to join in with this blatant collusion.

I wish it was just a case of personal prejudice, but when you stack up Chris Morris or Stewart Lee against Rhod Gilbert or Michael McIntyre, there really is a massive gulf in terms of quality, humour and intelligence.

We live in a media world where Frankie Boyle gets kicked off Mock The Week to make way for people like Holly Walsh.

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You need to get to clubs. Not the big weekend clubs, obviously.

Quote: Nat Wicks @ June 21 2012, 11:05 PM BST

You need to get to clubs. Not the big weekend clubs, obviously.

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That is good advice, however, in the meantime, I'm still paying my Television License fee for yet another series of 'Michael McIntyre's Comedy Roadshow'.

Imagine seeing all the comedians from the panel shows doing the same jokes but, get this, standing up? It's mind blowing.

Quote: Renegade Carpark @ June 21 2012, 3:31 PM BST

I have no idea how old you are Lee, but when I was growing up, all the McIntyre-style acts of the day (Tarby, Brucie, Wilmot, etc.) were swept aside by the 'alternative' comics.

We've now gone full circle and I am once again waiting for a brave comedy commissioner to herald in the next wave of dangerous, entertaining and original performers.*

That's not snobbery, it's taste.

*(like a new Alexei Sayle would last 5 minutes these days - Frankie Boyle can't tell a joke without everyone and their Mummy having a spaz fit of hypocritical mock outrage and complaining to the BBC - bunch o pussies)

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Sun columnist Boyle owes far more to the racist. sexist, homophobic bile of old school comics like Jim Davidson than he does to the furious political correctness of Alexei Sayle.

The wheel has only turned full circle in that yesterday's alternative comics are today's establishment; an up and coming comic who wishes to establish his anti-estbalishment credentials has nothing left to rebel agaisnt but niceness. Hence the scorn poured on the studiously inoffesive Michael McIntyre, and the reverence shown to the crudely bullying Frankie Boyle, a comic with whom Alexei would shudder to be mentioned in the same breath.

Quote: Tursiops @ June 21 2012, 11:24 PM BST

Sun columnist Boyle owes far more to teh rcist. sexist, homophobic bile of old school comics like Jim Davidson than he does to the furious political correctness of Alexei Sayle.

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Frankie Boyle owes his entire act to Jerry Sadowitz, the best comedian of the alternative revolution.

Thank goodness he skipped the stupid hat.

Quote: zooo @ June 21 2012, 11:30 PM BST

Thank goodness he skipped the stupid hat.

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He wore the hat to cover up his stupid floppy hair. Oh the irony.

I've just had MM Live and Laughing DVD come through from Lovefilm and am looking forward to it, so there

Quote: Shandonbelle @ June 21 2012, 11:36 PM BST

I've just had MM Live and Laughing DVD come through from Lovefilm and am looking forward to it, so there

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I retract all my previous arguments based on this evidence alone.

There's a good boy.

Quote: Renegade Carpark @ June 21 2012, 11:24 PM BST

I'm still paying my Television License fee

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Personally, I found this the most shocking part of the whole discussion! Renegade indeed.

RC, what about acts like Andrew Lawrence, Nick Helm, Doc Brown (and Dr Brown), Adam Riches that are starting to filter onto TV?

And let's not forget that Stewart Lee has his own show.

Kevin Eldon has been given his own show too, and you can bet that's going to a bit, well, 'alternative'! (And great!)

I suppose the 'alternative' Comedy Roadshow is going to be the show Lee is hosting on Comedy Central.

Quote: Tony Cowards @ June 22 2012, 9:11 AM BST

RC, what about acts like Andrew Lawrence, Nick Helm, Doc Brown (and Dr Brown), Adam Riches that are starting to filter onto TV?

And let's not forget that Stewart Lee has his own show.

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I think they are all very talented comedians and Nick Helm's aggressive posture and musical stylings are particularly noteworthy, but it's not backed up by the material. None of these comics have any 'bite', there's nothing memorable about their jokes or the topics they tackle.

Don't really want to get into the whole Stewart Lee thing, as I've criticised him as much as I've praised him, but at least I wouldn't be embarrassed to mention his name in the same breath as my other comedy heroes - Bill Hicks, Sam Kinison, Rob Newman, Dave Chappelle and Jerry Sadowitz.

Quote: Jane P @ June 22 2012, 6:14 AM BST

Personally, I found this the most shocking part of the whole discussion! Renegade indeed.

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I was speaking figuratively of course - unless there is a 'detection van' outside my house, then I mean that literally.

Quote: Tony Cowards @ June 22 2012, 9:11 AM BST

RC, what about acts like Andrew Lawrence, Nick Helm, Doc Brown (and Dr Brown), Adam Riches that are starting to filter onto TV?

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Adam Riches live show is brilliant; very, very funny..

Quote: Renegade Carpark @ June 22 2012, 11:21 AM BST

I think they are all very talented comedians and Nick Helm's aggressive posture and musical stylings are particularly noteworthy, but it's not backed up by the material. None of these comics have any 'bite', there's nothing memorable about their jokes or the topics they tackle.

Don't really want to get into the whole Stewart Lee thing, as I've criticised him as much as I've praised him, but at least I wouldn't be embarrassed to mention his name in the same breath as my other comedy heroes - Bill Hicks, Sam Kinison, Rob Newman, Dave Chappelle and Jerry Sadowitz.

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You're talking about stand ups, though. Has there ever been a golden age of stand up on telly? And, as has been remarked already, TV really isn't the best place for stand up.