I read the news today oh boy! Page 2,702

Agreed, that was a catastrophic misreading of the supply and demand of the job market and the resulting economy. We've ended up with tens of thousands of very overqualified shelf stackers and burger bar servers and a huge bill for the taxpayer, because they'll never earn enough to have to pay for their useless degrees and hundreds of thousands too snobbish to take the only jobs on offer because they've been sold a lie about the worth of most uni degrees, by Mr Education himself - resulting in many much needed menial jobs not being filled because most of the workforce are now too proud to take them, causing a problem for the normal running of society.

I do think it's a great shame that in the early nineties vocational focussed polytechnics started becoming universities and being able to offer degrees on anything. So in many ways our education woes are all the Tory parties fault, since they were in power then.

And yet... there are far more students today than there were under Blair. And yet unemployment has generally been higher under the Tories. Hmmm...perhaps the economy was just stronger under Blair?

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 16th November 2023, 7:32 AM

No, just Callaghan.

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You blame Callaghan for Thatcher. Personally, I blame Thatcher herself!
You blame Blair for Brexit. I blame Cameron, Farage and Johnson.
I also blame all the right-wingers like yourself who keenly supported Thatcher, the Iraq War and Brexit at the time and who now bend over backwards to blame anyone else they can think of for all of them.

Quote: chipolata @ 16th November 2023, 3:07 PM

I do think it's a great shame that in the early nineties vocational focussed polytechnics started becoming universities and being able to offer degrees on anything. So in many ways our education woes are all the Tory parties fault, since they were in power then.

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You're not wrong.

Surely the issue is that Education is seen as a vote winner, so both parties played around with it for political gain, rather than listen to Educationalists.

The good news is, the current thinking is that Industry should shape 90% of content of University Degrees & Apprenterships. But I'll believe that when I see a leadership capable of doing that. Didn't PM Boris write "Bollocks" on the Long Covid medical report ?

Why does anyone have to be blamed for Thatcher? She did a great job.

The below link aggregates various rankings of British PMs. Thatcher and Blair are considered the two most effective modern day PMs. But Clement Attlee beats Churchill to the top spot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_prime_ministers_of_the_United_Kingdom#External_links

Quote: Chappers @ 16th November 2023, 8:34 PM

Why does anyone have to be blamed for Thatcher? She did a great job.

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Brilliant if you're wealthy

For the rest of us she was a despicable old bastard

The council flat give away didn't benefit the wealthy, just increased our social housing problem. They won't even let you have tents now.

She privatised the crap out of everything

And ALL of it has turned to shit

Again, only the wealthy chairmen and owners and shareholders benefitted

The rest of us get the reward of garbage services and higher bills

She was a f**king clueless idiot

Given the Conservatives set pricing on the railways and gas companies, and have always kept ownership of the rail tracks (which they've failed to maintain despite setting their own targets) "privatisation" isn't a free market. Given how this government projected blame onto it own franchise, no reputable brand wants to be associated with that elephant trap. They've been caretaking rail franchises for a time , no one wants them. The unprecedented number of gas companies our government bankrupted has destroyed trust. They're still controlled by the government - they've just franchised out the blame. Another reason we need a change of government - no one of quality wants to business with the current one.

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 16th November 2023, 8:42 AM

hundreds of thousands too snobbish to take the only jobs on offer because they've been sold a lie about the worth of most uni degrees, by Mr Education himself - resulting in many much needed menial jobs not being filled because most of the workforce are now too proud to take them, causing a problem for the normal running of society.

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And now they may be forced to take them with this latest employment policy - take the job or lose your benefits and free health care. Like in the US where Rishi lived. Very hard line Conservative, even Thatcher didn't manage to pull that off.

Quote: chipolata @ 16th November 2023, 3:07 PM

I do think it's a great shame that in the early nineties vocational focussed polytechnics started becoming universities and being able to offer degrees on anything. So in many ways our education woes are all the Tory parties fault, since they were in power then.

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Well a lot of Polies also did degrees which were as popular with students as the B tec courses but weren't valued by employers because they weren't a Uni degree - pure human snobbishness. So to help stop this wastefulness they became unis, and still weren't valued by the top employers. The problem lies with people's ridiculous class bias and the rigid hierarchy of social class and their associated schools and Universities.

Stephen's graphic is spot on, many HE graduates are motivated by the social distinction of having a degree rather than its material worth, which has generally been degraded by the fact so many people have one now. And many feel they have to have one just to avoid being stigmatised. But there's never been anything like the number of careers available to match the expectations of HE grads, so it's just a cruel con for many.

Cornwall, voted for Brexit

"Cornwall Council has confirmed that the money it receives from the government to replace EU grants following Brexit will run out in a month's time, leaving over £230m of fund applications by Cornish communities and businesses unmet.

The council's shadow cabinet member for economy has said this is "devastating" and has accused the government of lying to Cornwall."

Yes we all got lied to. Reap/sow