Yes, sorry to hear that!
I read the news today oh boy! Page 1,926
So, what's the solution?
No clue. But a good start would be focusing on the men who are radicalising and brainwashing them into becoming suicide attackers. The police must have an idea who a lot of those people are.
Stop all weapons research except for the 'instant drop stun gun'.
Two advantages -
1. The terrorists don't get the death they long for, but a lifetime in prison and all the fun & games that will involve.
2. Gives the authorities a chance to question them and get intel on the rest of their shit-heel mates.
Quote: zooo @ 4th June 2017, 8:52 AMNo clue. But a good start would be focusing on the men who are radicalising and brainwashing them into becoming suicide attackers. The police must have an idea who a lot of those people are.
Agree with this, yet suspected terrorists are still left at large, I don't know how far the police and intelligence services can go with the information they gather, but if they have enough evidence to view them as a threat then surely more could be done to curtail / contain / them, the police need more manpower and more investment in a zero tolerance approach.
This is just so sad.
These scumbags want to be epic, legends in their own heads. So our best defence it not give them what they want. So I raise Lazzard's stun gun, to making it a criminal act to reveal the photo or name of these bombers in the Press. The courtroom sketch could be a picture of a turd. They will all be called "The Devil's Shit". No grave, just a flushing.
Here's a funny video about the devil's shit. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6P_oFhEjl8
This kind of terrorism has been around for a long time. The suicide bomber goes back to the Tamil Tigers and of course Kamikaze pilots during the war. So how were they defeated? By defeating the regime that bore them. Not so easy when you have an enemy spread over so many countries and a world wide system of communication.
Who are the big players? Undoubtedly Saudi Arabia as far as ISIS is concerned. Are we at war with this nation? I think we possibly should be. However instead we sell them arms.
Quote: Lazzard @ 4th June 2017, 10:42 AMStop all weapons research except for the 'instant drop stun gun'.
Such a thing is a pipe dream and it will never exist. Actual firearms are often ineffective in stopping people, and less-lethal methods like tasers are even less reliable. The best way to stop someone mid-rampage is to shoot to kill, and keep shooting them until they are no longer a threat. It's an imperfect solution, but it usually works.
The only thing that stopped yesterday's atrocity was a policeman's gun. A gun also stopped the Westminster attacker. It's not easy to stop attacks before they take place and preventative measures will never succeed 100% of the time, so a strong, armed police presence is the best response. I assume that the number of armed cops will continue to grow in London and at certain facilities, but the terrorists will just switch to softer targets elsewhere in the country.
Quote: Lazzard @ 4th June 2017, 10:42 AM1. The terrorists don't get the death they long for, but a lifetime in prison and all the fun & games that will involve.
They're often suicide bombers, so it's fairly certain that they'll manage to die without assistance from the police. And then they can have a long, expensive trial where they'll have a platform to spout off their nonsense, followed by an expensive period of incarceration where they'll have an opportunity to indoctrinate their fellow inmates.
The best option is to kill them. (Hopefully before they manage to harm any innocents.)
Quote: Firkin @ 4th June 2017, 1:18 PMThese scumbags want to be epic, legends in their own heads.
No, they want to kill people because they believe that it's what their religion demands. They're not in it for glory, they're in it for Allah.
Quote: DaButt @ 4th June 2017, 4:40 PMNo, they want to kill people because they believe that it's what their religion demands. They're not in it for glory, they're in it for Allah.
Then how come the majority of Muslim's condemn killing and want nothing to do with terrorism? They are in it for their own glory and because they are full of hate, nothing to do with obeying orders from above.
Quote: Shandonbelle @ 4th June 2017, 5:17 PMThen how come the majority of Muslim's condemn killing and want nothing to do with terrorism? They are in it for their own glory and because they are full of hate, nothing to do with obeying orders from above.
First of all, please note that I said "they believe that it's what their religion demands" and not "it is what their religion demands." That's an important distinction.
It's not hard to understand that they aren't in it for personal glory and that it's being done in the name of Allah because they tell us that it is. Tens of thousands of Muslims have left good jobs and families behind to fight in Iraq and Syria and countless other countries. They're doing it out of religious fervor because they think it's their duty. They want to build a worldwide Islamic caliphate. They tell us this over and over again. It may not actually be what Islam itself wants, or what most Muslims want, but it's what they want and they have huge numbers of backers.
It's pointless to argue whether or not Islam itself is to blame, but the followers' interpretation of Islam is what counts. The religion itself is a passive entity, but its subjects are not. Let's not forget that there are entire nations whose laws are based on Islam. There are nearly a dozen of those countries where homosexuality is punishable by death. Blasphemy is punishable by death. Beheadings are meted out by the government. Women can't be in the company of unrelated males. Chants of "Death to America, Death to Israel" are heard at government functions and in mosques. Possession of a bible is a crime in some nations.
Islam itself is not a problem. The majority of Muslims are not a problem. But there are entire nations and millions of Muslims who have a very extreme interpretation of their religion and they play by their own set of rules. The world is not a black and white place, so while our tendency to embrace religious and individual freedom is the right thing to do, that doesn't mean that there aren't people out there who would behead/enslave/bomb you because of your own religion, or lack thereof.
All obvious stuff of which most of us are already aware of. It's how to tackle the problem that seems to be the stumbling block, Theresa May said today that 'they' had been too tolerant' who is 'they'? the government? the world? next doors cat? and what was the point even, is that supposed to be some comfort to the nation?? What, so now 'they'll do something? I just don't know.
Quote: Shandonbelle @ 4th June 2017, 6:12 PMTheresa May said today that 'they' had been too tolerant' who is 'they'? the government? the world? next doors cat? and what was the point even, is that supposed to be some comfort to the nation?? What, so now 'they'll do something? I just don't know.
I assume she meant that the government had been too tolerant. Most/all of the recent attackers were known to intelligence agencies, so perhaps they need to round potential terrorists up earlier in the game. It's tough to do so within the law.
Some prudent deterrent, preventive and corrective measures:
Greater infiltration and surveillance of mosques known to harbor radicals.
Increased Internet surveillance of suspected radicals.
Increased efforts at convincing people to rat out anyone who speaks out in favor of terrorism.
Mandatory prison sentences, revocation of citizenship, and/or deportation for people who travel abroad to wage jihad.
More armed police on the streets. Everyone deserves armed protection, not just government officials and sensitive facilities.
And, most of all, we just need to keep killing the bad guys. Preferably overseas, before they can head back home from Syria, etc. and kill in their home countries. The U.S. has outlined plans to try to kill as many ISIS members as they can as the organization loses territory, rather than allow them to slink off back home. "Total annihilation."
http://www.militarytimes.com/articles/jim-mattis-annihilate-isis-iraq-syria
Quote: Lazzard @ 4th June 2017, 10:42 AMStop all weapons research except for the 'instant drop stun gun'.
I just read that London police fired 50 rounds in order to kill the 3 terrorists. That's another indication of just how unlikely an 'instant drop stun gun' is.
Never thought I'd come to the conclusion that armed police was the way forward but it is, as DaButt said, no stun gun would have worked to stop them under those circumstances, dark at night, chaotic, running amok with knives, the police gunning them down was the only thing that saved lives.
Mandatory prison sentences, revocation of citizenship, and/or deportation for people who travel abroad to wage jihad.
I'm inclined towards letting them back into this country then arresting them and trying them for Treason. I think the death penalty still applies to Treason.
Quote: DaButt @ 4th June 2017, 5:58 PMThey're doing it out of religious fervor because they think it's their duty. They want to build a worldwide Islamic caliphate.
Do you think that Western intervention in the Middle East (especially from the Soviet-Afghanistan War to the Gulf War to the Iraq invasion, ousting of Gadaffi, NATO strikes in Syria, etc) has contributed to the rise of militant Islam and terror attacks on the West? Or was Islamic fanaticism always going to carry out such attacks, regardless of Western involvement in Middle Eastern conflicts?
Quote: billwill @ 5th June 2017, 2:45 AMI'm inclined towards letting them back into this country then arresting them and trying them for Treason. I think the death penalty still applies to Treason.
Precisely. If you remove a tick from a dog, you don't just kindly place it over the fence next door. You squish it, incinerate the remains and bathe the dog in anti-tick shampoo. Then go for a happy run with the dog.