That all sounds good planting-wise.
Thank you - I do have some gardening experience having had a very large garden in the 70s and my own garden retail business in the 80s.

The plum & cherry are definitely best fan-trained ( I think it's to do with plenty of air round the fruit?)
Might be best to treat the apple & pear the same way in terms of best use of space.
Thanks for that, as I was going to ask you - fan or espalier, and I see on the RHS site it says the support wires should be about 4" away from fence/wall for air circulation

So I'm guessing your starting with two/three year old saplings?
The supplier states they are two years old

Or has someone done the first bit of training already?
Sadly no - cheap that is, me 😁

My main, overarching advice is to be brutal with fruit thinning - the limited number of leaves means it can only support a certain amount of fruit.
Be satisfied with less quantity and more quality (not that pears will ever.give you much trouble in this regard as they 're pretty shy fruiters).
I'll be doing plenty of reading up on the RHS or Gardener's World

Worth thinking about frost protection - if you get it where you are.
Stone-fruits - depending on breed - can be pretty early blossomers - and an early frost can bugger up your year.
A couple of layers of fleece at the right time will do the job.
I don't think we get it that severe. So, are you saying cover the whole tree, not just the root area?

And if you have squirrels, a spiral trunk protector for the base of the trunk.
Not plagued with them, but do see the odd one, especially since I've stopped feeding them (or stopped them pinching the bird food/nuts) - also humanely trapped about half dozen or so, which I released in the local cemetery. Would the trunk protection work that well, as all I see of the little buggers is them leaping across the bird feeders, so would they not leap up the trees, which let's face it will not be that high and they'll have the wires to scramble on. I have to say, a bit worrying that, as they used to annoy me when they pinched the bird's peanuts, then dug holes in my (I can't call it lawn) grass patch to bury/store them - damned nuisance.

Quote: Hercules Grytpype Thynne @ 22nd November 2023, 3:45 PM

So, are you saying cover the whole tree, not just the root area?
Roots not the problem. Its the frost nipping the flowers/flowerbuds. As you have wires/framework in place you just need to temporarily drape the tree to protect them(don't leave on). But only if you get a frost warning and the species of tree has a particularly early blossom (Cherries worst for this. A hard early frost round here and the commercial cherry harvest is decimated

Would the trunk protection work that well, as all I see of the little buggers is them leaping across the bird feeders, so would they not leap up the trees, which let's face it will not be that high and they'll have the wires to scramble on.
What they do is gnaw at the bark at the base of the trunk - this can really set growth back. That;s the bit that needs protecting. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Protectors-Plastic-Protecting-Saplings-Rodents/dp/B0C1RTN3C8/ref=sr_1_15?crid=13ZBETX1MEIL6&keywords=tree+trunk+protectors&qid=1700674807&sprefix=tree+trunk+protectors%2Caps%2C63&sr=8-15

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Ah! Got it - thanks for that, I'll order some. Pack of 4 for £12 and I have four trees - couldn't be better! 😊

There was something else on pruning on the RHS site I'll come back to you on, if I may - not totally sure what that meant, and too tired to look now.

In the meantime, thank you Lazzard 🙂

Quote: Lazzard @ 22nd November 2023, 10:55 AM

That all sounds good planting-wise.
The plum & cherry are definitely best fan-trained ( I think it's to do with plenty of air round the fruit?)
Might be best to treat the apple & pear the same way in terms of best use of space.
So I'm guessing your starting with two/three year old saplings?

View original

OK, so all 4 fruit trees and 5 raspberry canes are in (a job which used to take me a quarter of the time 40 years ago, before the bad left knee, bad right hip and breathless COPD - and of course old age!!)

Now the RHS query re training the tree in a fan shape :

"Starting with a feathered maiden (a one-year-old-tree with some branches) or untrained two-year-old tree
In spring, cut back the main stem to about 40cm (15in) to two well-placed branches to form the main 'arms'"

It's this cutting the main stem back so short - surely you need to let it get some height so you can add other branches in the fan? And speaking of which, here is a couple of photos of the cherry, and you will see what I have to work with.

And I presume I cut off any branch that is pointing away from the wall (see the two highlighted in photos), OR do I bend them around and secure to the wire frame, bearing in mind I seem to have enough side shoots with this tree, but maybe not so many with a couple of the others - plenty of buds though?

I think the 40cm bit is for a traditional 'old-school' fan-trained tree (see illustration)

I imagine, though that this would take up a deal more space - too much, maybe.
So you might, as I have done (now I look at my own trees), go for a slight combination of fan & cordon.
So keep your main stem (until it gets to height) and train your side shoots at a 45 degree-ish, or slightly shallower, angle.
And yes, unless you're woefully short of side-shoots, prune off any forward or backward facing shoots.
I would say you need at least a foot(vertically) between side-shoots - don't be tempted to have them any more crowded than that.

In searching for the above pic I came across this site.
Very informative and worth a look. https://realenglishfruit.co.uk/how-to-train-fruit-trees/

Thank so much Lazzard, most informative and what you have suggested is what I was thinking, so you have put my mind at rest, and is what I will definitely be going for. 😊

Chilli plants still cropping.
Trouble is, I'm going to need the greenhouse space pretty soon - so might have to get rid.
Still, we've got a freezer-full and the better half has been pickling Jalapenos like a maniac.
Should see us through.

I grew some chillies and peppers on the window sill in the spare bedroom. Easy to forget to water them but they didn't seem to mind.
They too cropped and cropped.

They're pretty forgiving.
Unless the old White Fly move in.

Last of the tulips in.
A week or so late, but the weather's been so shite.
Nice bright winter's day round here.
I can cope with that..

Put mine in about 2 weeks ago in a (Grecian urn style) planter, with a spike mat over them to stop that bloody black and white cat using the neat compost surface as a toilet - Grrrr!!!

I have to bury chicken wire about 2 inches below the surface to stop th bloody squirrels nicking the bulbs.
I have loads of bits cut to shape which I label (forgot the first year - took me ages to work out which bit went with which pot!) and tuck away when I dig over the pots for summer stuff.

My tulips are starting to poke their little heads through the soil already! Awww.............

I have befriended a squirrel - even though it is definitely cupboard love.
His name is Cyril and he takes food from my hand.

Squirrels are well known for their poor judgement