Just watched the first one. Good points: Beautifully shot. Both leads perform well, although it was a little gag light. I'd personally only use improv as a brainstorming technique to get at a finished scripted performance but that's my personal opinion. The secondary roles were poor. They kept breaking the illusion of watching 'drama' for me (I know it's comedy, if you catch my drift).

However, the one big BIG problem is Dan's character. During the grieving student scene (which is a great performance from Dan btw), he speaks and acts so much like Gervais it's unbelievable. It's not just a vague simularity, it is totally utterly Brent, in words, delivery, and actions. No one in the biz will fail to spot this and it'll be a major stumbling block, without doubt. You'll need to rework that character asap.

Quote: SlagA @ June 21 2009, 4:55 PM BST

Just watched the first one. Good points: Beautifully shot. Both leads perform well, although it was a little gag light. I'd personally only use improv as a brainstorming technique to get at a finished scripted performance but that's my personal opinion. The secondary roles were poor. They kept breaking the illusion of watching 'drama' for me (I know it's comedy, if you catch my drift).

However, the one big BIG problem is Dan's character. During the grieving student scene (which is a great performance from Dan btw), he speaks and acts so much like Gervais it's unbelievable. It's not just a vague simularity, it is totally utterly Brent, in words, delivery, and actions. No one in the biz will fail to spot this and it'll be a major stumbling block, without doubt. You'll need to rework that character asap.

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Thanks for watching it. I'm glad you think it's "Beautifully shot" as I said before our DOP Josh Coulston did a great job although saying that he was lead by us directors.

Thanks for the compliment in regards to the acting, we have been surprised by people's reactions to our acting as we (thought) we were primarily writers rather then actors but as so many people including a few producers have said maybe I should focus on my comedy acting rather then writing and just do a bit of additional material.

This is often a problem for myself and Dan in our films and something which has been picked up upon many times by industry names that the supporting roles are not developed/acted well enough and our performances seem to be individual performances rather then ensemble performances. The reason for this is, one the actors we get our not actually actors and two myself and Dan are greedy for laughs, I don't know if this is his opinion but we both are used to being the star in our own comedy vehicles so usually we carry the show single handily so for us to both be in something and both have TWO good character is a step up from one good character.

I don't speak for Dan but in my opinion I feel you are on the whole right about Dan's character having too many similarities with Brent. There are reasons for this and they are because we both are huge Office fans so we both find that kind of humour very funny also both myself and Dan have both done shows were we play David Brent esc characters so we have grew up imitating and spoofing it. This is more so the case with Dan as his last show before this 'Backstage' was him playing a character called Steve Kent who looks up to Brent so there is still bits of that performance carried over it to this but saying that it is a issue which can be resolved with more time spent on the character and the series hasn't got as many moments of Brent esc humour as the demo pilot and Dan's a versatile actor who can adapt easily into having more Aspin moments then Brent moments.

There's nothing wrong with be able to do a good Brent. Many bands start out doing cover versions before they write their own material. Now you just need to move away from (unconsciously) imitating what you like and find your own voices.

What about characters nearer your own age? Create some brilliant characters - physically you're both quite different so create two opposing characters again - that nearer your real ages and try some improv and see where it goes from there...

Quote: bigfella @ June 21 2009, 12:56 PM BST

I might put money on James making it big - after all, he has generated the biggest number of posts that I think I have ever seen here.

He's just lucky Morrace has gone!

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Thanks for the vote in confidence, really appreciated it. I'm starting work on a purposed series of comedy sketches for the BBC. Having a meeting with the producer Jan who is from Screenplay Productions on Thursday. It's weird because how he got hold of me was from this very website so if I do make it big then I'll plug the website and I think were plug it anyway because myself and Dan are doing a Q/A with a company called Devon & Cornwall film who want to promote the show.

Quote: James Cotter @ June 21 2009, 7:19 PM BST

Having a meeting with the producer Jan who is from Screenplay Productions on Thursday.

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To discuss this show or another project?

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ June 21 2009, 7:15 PM BST

There's nothing wrong with be able to do a good Brent. Many bands start out doing cover versions before they write their own material. Now you just need to move away from (unconsciously) imitating what you like and find your own voices.

What about characters nearer your own age? Create some brilliant characters - physically you're both quite different so create two opposing characters again - that nearer your real ages and try some improv and see where it goes from there...

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I agree we both started out imitating as a starting block. We've both started out doing 'Little Britain' Live on stage for charity when we're both 14/15 then I moved on to hosting 'Deal or no Deal' for my school and that cultivated in us both doing Brent. Me a show called 'Forgone Conclusion' where I play a super fan called Paul Wade and Dan doing Steve Kent in 'Backstage'. Saying all of that we both have done other things that are our own like a audio podcast/video podcast/radio show with I've been doing for 4 ½ years on and off. Dan's done stand up in London which he very good at and I've done my own short film called 'Harris & Doyle: Let The Good Times Roll' which has no Brent influences at all.

I know what you mean about doing characters are own age but we have never come up with anything for our own age bracket. I especially like playing older characters as I'm a wannabe Clive Dunn but we will give it a thought. Thanks

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ June 21 2009, 7:22 PM BST

To discuss this show or another project?

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Another project. I don't know too much about it as my role will be as actor rather then a writer so I am meeting the writers/performances and will chat about the show's future.

So far things are looking great as Jan has attend a meeting with Simon Lupton (BBC Comedy Commissioning Editor) to discuss the project in detail. And it will be for the new BBC comedy website featuring new and old comedy talent.

I will be playing a lonely, easily upset radio host who frequently gets calls from a character named Stuart who (in real life) used to appear on The Scott Mills Show regularly, here's the link for the character… http://www.unofficialmills.co.uk/communities/local_links.php?catid=20

Quote: Matthew Stott @ June 21 2009, 4:55 PM BST

That's weird, I did an Anne Frank on Twitter sketch for Newsjack last week! Didn't get on mind you.

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I certainly found Anne Frank on Twitter funny so did my co-writer. Better luck next time.

Quote: Scottidog @ June 21 2009, 3:21 PM BST

It is obvious to me, that you two guys are big Gervais and Merchant fans.

you could not obviously play the parts you have written for, as you are both too young to play them.

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Agree.

Quote: random @ June 21 2009, 8:20 PM BST

Agree.

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When it comes to making it as a TV show I agree but now as a demo pilot with no budget and two actors who can act I think it was the right/only thing to do. It is after all only the demo pilot, not even the proper pilot or even a actual episode.

James, are you and Dan partners?

Quote: don rushmore @ June 21 2009, 8:38 PM BST

James, are you and Dan partners?

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Comedy partners yes. But we both have solo projects to.

Mate, bottom line for me is it ain't funny... it maybe to your mates and those that know you, but...

You two perform well.

Also, it's not at all believable 'cos you're both playing parts that are above your age.

Why don't you create some new characters of your own age? It was the same with that detective thing you did, instantly not believable 'cos of the age.

May I add, good on ya tho' for getting off your arse and doing it.

This is a very rare visit into Critique for me, but there seems to have been a lot of feedback on this one, so I wanted to take a look.

It's a generally well-shot and polished piece of filming, so no problems there.

First problem is that it's really not funny. There's no real jokes or laughs in the whole thing. The format is predictable and been done a lot better. The main characters don't really have anything of substance about them. They're "out of stock" - chilled-out wanker who thinks he's cool - and "zany" ex-army sergeant-major type. Why are they teachers? Who cares? I know this is a quick "demo pilot", but for a 12 minute piece you need to have a tight, witty script to sell your situation and characters. This just rambles. What you may have considered funny little nuances in the dialogue or performance are mannered or fall flat. The acting is poor (other, ironically, than a couple of the extras in speaking roles). It is also uneven - one of you is trying to do naturalistic, whilst the other is "heightened" to the point of giganticism.

If it were funny, or original at all, then one might make allowances for what seems a self-indulgent piece of work. You need to be very, very, very good to make improv work. This doesn't. You would be better off spending a lot more time working on characters, plot and dialogue.

This is not an embarrassment to watch, but it falls short of anything that's likely to interest a network. It shows great drive and ambition to be producing work of this technical competence, but the fundamental issue of getting laughs is what you have to address. Writer-performers will always be attractive to the TV industry, but on both counts this falls well short.

Best of luck with Jan and for all your future endeavours. Keep at it.

Quote: random @ June 21 2009, 8:55 PM BST

Mate, bottom line for me is it ain't funny... it maybe to your mates and those that know you, but...

You two perform well.

Also, it's not at all believable 'cos you're both playing parts that are above your age.

Why don't you create some new characters of your own age? It was the same with that detective thing you did, instantly not believable 'cos of the age.

May I add, good on ya tho' for getting off your arse and doing it.

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I don't agree I think it is funny. I'm not saying it's always laugh out loud funny but it is funny there are some good moments of humour. Also as explained earlier it has been shown to more then mates and it's due to be screened at a public screening where anyone can attend so it's just not a student film.

Thanks for the acting compliment. This is something we both want to move into more regularly whether it's a project by us or the part is written for us.

The age thing has cropped up time and time again and I have explained this, when it comes to actually making it there will be actors playing of a certain age playing the roles.

Thanks for also watching "that detective thing you did" or 'Harris & Doyle: Let The Good Times Roll' although I agree again I think I actually look older as Harris then I do in real life.

And as you said at least we doing stuff. It may not be perfect but we're still doing stuff.

Out of interest if you had to commit what would say was funnier: 'Harris & Doyle: Let The Good Times Roll' or 'Back to Class - Thank Your For The Music'?

Quote: Matthew Stott @ June 21 2009, 4:55 PM BST

That's weird, I did an Anne Frank on Twitter sketch for Newsjack last week! Didn't get on mind you.

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That maybe the worst idea for a BBC (don't frighten the horses) comedy sketch ever!

Newsrevue would probably love it.

Now back to my Lenny Henry cannibal witch doctor sketch.

Quote: James Cotter @ June 21 2009, 8:40 PM BST

Comedy partners yes. But we both have solo projects to.

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I think he was implying something fruitier...