Roseanne Page 3

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Sitcomfan64

  • Thursday 7th June 2018, 5:36pm
  • England
  • 319 posts
Quote: zooo @ 30th May 2018, 5:33 PM

I don't think someone can realistically grow up in America (for 50? 60 years? I'm not sure of her age) and then claim ignorance of the fact that likening a black woman to a monkey is racist, and is going to be taken as racist by most people.

Of course she has the right to say anything she wants. But she doesn't have the right to face no consequences. Everything you say has consequences.

Just wanted to quote this to reiterate what an important point that is. Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences, and the amount of people who seem not to realise that is quite staggering.

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ArticulateMadness

  • Thursday 7th June 2018, 9:13pm
  • United States
  • 128 posts
Quote: Kenneth @ 31st May 2018, 10:47 AM

She's still busy on Twitter.

The context of those Hitler photos: It was for a satirical Jewish magazine's Germany issue. And Roseanne is a Jew. And she's nuts.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/did-roseanne-pose-as-adolf-hitler-photo-shoot/
As she said at the time:
"I don't give a f**k what people think. I care what people do. I don't care what they think. That's what I'm trying to say. Let's stop holocausts. When I did The Star Spangled Banner -- let's care about freedom, instead of symbols of freedom for a f**king change. You know what I mean, I don't know. I'm just really old. When you're post-menopausal, you're just really crazy."

This was a horrible satire but lacked zero consequences.

Quote: Sitcomfan64 @ 7th June 2018, 5:36 PM

Just wanted to quote this to reiterate what an important point that is. Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences, and the amount of people who seem not to realise that is quite staggering.

This should not have been any consequences for something done on her PERSONAL twitter account. She didnt speak for her show, or her castmates, or anyone else. And it was a joke in bad taste, albeit a bigoted one. If Roseanne had no consequences to her Hitler spoof, why is America making a big deal out of this when Dotard and his 40% talk shit about any race they please derogatorily every DAY. Dotard does this at HIS RALLIES. Watch some of them. His "supporters" are chanting derogatory names like __________ go home, kill all ____________ .

And you may fill in the __________ with the racist word of your choice. But I fail to see the POTUS coming out with such biting intentional racist remarks, but Roseanne all of a sudden is getting punished? This is a character slaughter simply for her jumping off the Bernie train and becoming a Trumpista with the liberal agenda of Hollywood. And like I said, she's been doing dumb shit like this this ENTIRE time of Dotard's Presidency. He opened up this can of whoop ass and made is politically correct to have a mouth like Archie Bunker, and there is no putting this genie back in the bottle from here on out.

Once again, I don't like much that comes out of her mouth. But I will defend her right under this country's constitution to say what she feels. And when you have a political opinion in bad taste on your own personal accounts, that should not be held against you. That is called FASCISM. The fascism going on in America is intolerable with this PC bullshit.

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Sixty3closure

  • Saturday 9th June 2018, 12:59am
  • W1A, Scotland
  • 75 posts

As Voltaire didn't actually say ""I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it". Not sure I entirely agree but I think there's many things that get lost in translation as they cross the Atlantic such as the 'right to bear arms'.
It sort of reminds me of people who start a sentence by saying "nothing personal but...." when it very much is personal.
As a (former) journalist I do believe in free speech but I'm not convinced this gives you the right to say whatever you want but its difficult to define.

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ArticulateMadness

  • Saturday 9th June 2018, 7:26am [Edited]
  • United States
  • 128 posts
Quote: Sixty3closure @ 9th June 2018, 12:59 AM

As Voltaire didn't actually say ""I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it". Not sure I entirely agree but I think there's many things that get lost in translation as they cross the Atlantic such as the 'right to bear arms'.
It sort of reminds me of people who start a sentence by saying "nothing personal but...." when it very much is personal.
As a (former) journalist I do believe in free speech but I'm not convinced this gives you the right to say whatever you want but its difficult to define.

I'm an advocate for comedians bringing politically biting commentary good or bad to the forefront, as comedy is the last bastion of freedom of speech America really has left. Having said that, Roseanne has a right to say what she feels personally on her political feelings as the 1st Amendment freedom of speech/expression gives her the right to do so. Okay, a porch monkey joke was in INCREDIBLY bigoted taste, but as I've said before, thanks to Dotard, the Archie Bunkers of the world are out and about, and ain't about to go back into the shame closet. Any time you limit freedom of speech just a little bit, its fascism. Censorship is fundamentally out of control in America right now. I don't like what the KKK says, I don't like white nationalists websites, but they shouldn't be censored. The information should be out there. You can say as you please - until you start doing (and ergo committing a crime). Yes, its a slippery slope, but the minute people say Roseanne should be censored but the Black Panthers get a pass; when David Duke is supposed to be censored but Malcolm X commentary turns a blind eye - see where I'm going with this?

You can't pick and choose. We do not have hate speech laws, and are within our own constitution allowed to express ALL opinions, good, bad and ugly. The minute you cherry pick based on PCness is the minute fascism comes into play. And trust and believe, America got enough of that as is.

ABC should not have jumped on the bandwagon and ended the show. Let the ratings decide. If Americans were that butthurt about it, the ratings would have told the tale and the natural progression of cancellation would have happened. Or were they afraid many Americans would have supported it to their shock and awe and the ratings soared? People like Richard Pryor OPENLY called whites many derogatory names in his comedy in the 1970s. Black folks as well. As did his peers. Nobody batted an eye.

But Roseanne, after a satirical Nazi spread, likens a woman she never even saw to Planet of the Apes who just happened to be black and the torches are out. Ain't buying it.

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Definitely Tarby

  • Friday 22nd June 2018, 10:40pm
  • South South West, England
  • 1,243 posts

Good to see they will carry on but it could be difficult to write her out of it and keep the upbeat tone. They should definitely change the set so it looks like they have moved. I've not seen any of new series yet so are they still in the same house? Are the camera shots of the living room and kitchen the same as the original? If they are that should change. Now that the dust has settled it does feel like ABC overeacted in sacking her. Yes she was foolish but I don't think it makes her a racist and it's an example of the outrage social media can cause. Someone takes offence and shares it online and it snowballs so much that even television networks take notice. Eeeee, it wasn't like that in my day. I think it's fair to say they acted in a financial sense not a moral one but of course disguise it as a moral decision to the public.

I found her post very offensive but I'm proportionate about how I react and the whirlwind hatred stirred up online has no time for being reasonable or open to debate. Or even just open to forgivness and accepting of remorse. They just want a head on a spike NOW. I posted a GIF from the film Blazing Saddles at work recently because I find the exchange so funny but in hindsight it could have been offensive to some because of the racial sterotype used in the witty retort. I'm not comparing it to what Roseanne did because they are both different but it's an example of how something I see as totally inoffensive could in fact be offensive to others.

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ArticulateMadness

  • Saturday 23rd June 2018, 1:35am
  • United States
  • 128 posts
Quote: Definitely Tarby @ 22nd June 2018, 10:40 PM

Good to see they will carry on but it could be difficult to write her out of it and keep the upbeat tone. They should definitely change the set so it looks like they have moved. I've not seen any of new series yet so are they still in the same house? Are the camera shots of the living room and kitchen the same as the original? If they are that should change. Now that the dust has settled it does feel like ABC overeacted in sacking her. Yes she was foolish but I don't think it makes her a racist and it's an example of the outrage social media can cause. Someone takes offence and shares it online and it snowballs so much that even television networks take notice. Eeeee, it wasn't like that in my day. I think it's fair to say they acted in a financial sense not a moral one but of course disguise it as a moral decision to the public.

I found her post very offensive but I'm proportionate about how I react and the whirlwind hatred stirred up online has no time for being reasonable or open to debate. Or even just open to forgivness and accepting of remorse. They just want a head on a spike NOW. I posted a GIF from the film Blazing Saddles at work recently because I find the exchange so funny but in hindsight it could have been offensive to some because of the racial sterotype used in the witty retort. I'm not comparing it to what Roseanne did because they are both different but it's an example of how something I see as totally inoffensive could in fact be offensive to others.

They are probably going to have her OD on pain pills since that was her climax point during the season reboot since she couldn't afford knee surgery. They went with the opiod kick and since she was still sneaking and popping pills, they are probably gonna make her a junkie walking through the twilight and takes her own self out. Doubt they change the set. Dan was already struggling and with Becky an alcoholic wreck and Darlene moving back with her kids, doubtful they could afford a move. Yeah, same house. Same rebuilt from the original, which is why ABC probably trying to reboot, since they spent a lot of money redoing the set to spec.

Yep, ABC overacted. But that is the Dotard Presidency PC culture for you. They should have let the viewers decide and go on with life but nope. And its still got some flames fanned. However, you're not taking into consideration the racial climate in America - calling or referencing a black person as any type of primate is a 4 alarm riot. And it is historically offensive to black people, even if the person in question looks like the Planet of the Apes character in question. Britain has a different post slavery history with their blacks than America has with theirs. The fact that Matt Lucas and David Wallingham get away with Blackface over there but over here would be tarred, feathered, and probably shot for it is the difference in toleration attitude because quite frankly America has never dealt nor gotten over their racial issues of the past and probably wont.

And the only reason why Blazing Saddles got away with so much is because Mel Brooks got Richard Pryor in on the script. Without him, his career would have ended. Look that tidbit up for further info.

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Chappers

  • Saturday 23rd June 2018, 5:48pm
  • Surreyish., England
  • 29,168 posts
Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 23rd June 2018, 12:43 PM

Titbit

That's more the kind of comment I'm prepared to read,

Quote: Definitely Tarby @ 22nd June 2018, 10:40 PM

I posted a GIF from the film Blazing Saddles at work recently because I find the exchange so funny but in hindsight it could have been offensive to some because of the racial sterotype used in the witty retort. I'm not comparing it to what Roseanne did because they are both different but it's an example of how something I see as totally inoffensive could in fact be offensive to others.

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The difference is that the blacks* involved were all in on the joke and the white people were its butt. There was nothing racist in this whatsoever.

* Sorry. Not sure what the current PC term is as it seems to keep changing.

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