Being proud of your country is wholly misplaced pride.
The idea that someone is 'proud' to be British or 'Spanish' or 'German' or whatever is total bunk.
You are from whatever country you are born in (not your choice) and in reality there is absolutely nothing for you to be proud of with respect to that!
Also, just about every country has a 'dark past' about something they did or didn't do..
Frankie, some of your logic is hilarious. Why should the "mistakes" of the past have any consequence about how someone feels about something now?
And I'm not even going to start on the argument that you shouldn't be proud of something you have no control over.
(In any case, patriotism doesn't necessarily equate to being 'proud', certainly not in the context in which you're applying it.)
It's simple tribal war fare. Protect your own, destroy the others.
As for the flag waving, it can get a bit much because it's the only chance we get to do it. The rest of the time we are made to be ashamed of being english by the media.
If your argument is correct then why should the glories of the past have any effect on how people feel now? If British citizens are proud of their national heritage then they surely must be ashamed of much of it. Britain has built a few castles and won a few wars in its time but it has also been responsible for slavery and imperialism on a vast scale.
Of course, you may be entirely indifferent to the past Aaron but why do you take any national pride?
I love Britain because it's home to me, but if I had been born in Finland then I doubt that I'd curse the universe for denying me the opportunity to be British.
Quote: Cinnamon @ November 23, 2007, 11:44 AMIf your argument is correct then why should the glories of the past have any effect on how people feel now?
Good point! On reflection, I think it probably works both ways. People will be ashamed and/or proud of different aspects, so I guess it pretty much balances out. Something like that. Good point though. 
Quote: Cinnamon @ November 23, 2007, 11:44 AMOf course, you may be entirely indifferent to the past Aaron but why do you take any national pride?
Achievements, rich history ('good' or 'bad'), language, nature, architecture, landscape, beauty of much of the countryside, culture (well, some...), and much of those aspects' ilk; save some of the politics - certainly the current spectrum. 
Quote: Cinnamon @ November 23, 2007, 11:44 AMI love Britain because it's home to me, but if I had been born in Finland then I doubt that I'd curse the universe for denying me the opportunity to be British.
Indeed, indeed. Not all of the aspects I outlined above are exclusive to us, and not all are of our control, but as you say, here is where I was born and live, so here is where I love.
Quote: jacparov @ November 23, 2007, 11:44 AMProtect your own, destroy the others.
i'm with you. lets destroy stuff. can we start with people who look different from me?
The French.
trust me, everyone looks different from me.
What, you're like, a goblin from the centre of the Earth? 
there you go with the LOTR stuff again, you're a fan really aren't you!
With due apologies to those still smarting, I was sent this on email today. I especially liked the final sentence
Very funny! haha
I heard that they got paid 150,000 each to play in that game. That's more in 90 minutes than I earn in about six years - they should have paid me - i'd have certainly put in more effort than they did the other night.
Quote: Aaron @ November 23, 2007, 11:04 AMFrankie, some of your logic is hilarious. Why should the "mistakes" of the past have any consequence about how someone feels about something now?
And I'm not even going to start on the argument that you shouldn't be proud of something you have no control over.
(In any case, patriotism doesn't necessarily equate to being 'proud', certainly not in the context in which you're applying it.)
Mistakes of the past are of course TOTALLY relevant to how we should feel now.
Look at any of the current problem areas in the World today and then look at their history. If you actually know what has happended in the past, actually care about anything at all and you have a brain cell or two available, then that would affect the way you feel now.
Of course, that might not include you, Aaron!
Patriotism and pride ALWAYS but ALWAYS go together hand in glove, have you not noticed that?
As you don't want to even start on the argument that you shouldn't be proud of something you have no control over, I must assume you have no opinion worth bothering with!
Pshaw!
Quote: Cinnamon @ November 23, 2007, 11:44 AMIf your argument is correct then why should the glories of the past have any effect on how people feel now? If British citizens are proud of their national heritage then they surely must be ashamed of much of it. Britain has built a few castles and won a few wars in its time but it has also been responsible for slavery and imperialism on a vast scale.
Of course, you may be entirely indifferent to the past Aaron but why do you take any national pride?
I love Britain because it's home to me, but if I had been born in Finland then I doubt that I'd curse the universe for denying me the opportunity to be British.
Hear! Hear! I am British but my love is for the World not for Britain. In reality national boundaries and national pride and prejudices are a total nonsense not worthy of anyone who deigns to call themselves 'human' (as opposed to 'animal')
Animals can be very territorial, maybe some of us are more animal than we like to think? Maybe all of us.. 
There are literally millions of people in the World whose very existence is at risk everyday of their lives and we are 'proud to British' ... what utter CRAP is that pride!!! 
Eng-land, Eng-land uber alles!!!
Jurgen Klinsmann as England manager - A HA HA HA HA HA!