Quote: Tim Walker @ October 6 2010, 3:00 PM BST

I completely agree that it's a real craft, I just don't see that craft being very well executed in this show. The shoehorning going on to achieve the jokes is immense. And the gags that result are generally of such a poor standard, so as to not be worth it. I don't think there is much "subtle" joke-writing going on here, just limp, unfunny gags which neither a) are integral to the plot - which is a sign of really good writing, nor b) flow naturally from the characters - the jokes define the characters rather than the other way around. Anyway...

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Actually I thought all the jokes flowed from the characters.
Anyway, you hate it, I like it. That's comedy for you, innit?

Quote: Will Cam @ October 6 2010, 3:04 PM BST

Sorry Lee, could you maybe highlight the several gags per page in a colour. I am having trouble finding them.

BIB:
Clumsiest man I've ever met in my life. Yesterday he slipped on some cooking oil and threw four dozen eggs in the air. It's like being in a silent movie.

ROLAND LAUGHS.

BIB: (CNT'D)
I need help in the kitchen, Roland! Sarah says I'm working too hard.

ROLAND:
How is Sarah?

BIB:
Wouldn't know, would I? Barely see her these days. It's last thing at night and first thing in the morning, just the back of her head resting on the pillow. Might not even be her, she might've escaped! For all I know it could be just cushions and a wig!

ROLAND:
You know me and Rebecca went through a similar thing. Never saw each other, and when we did it was just bicker, bicker, bicker. We became strangers. But you know what? We worked through it, yeah? (HE PLACES HIS HAND WISELY ON BIB'S SHOULDER) Always remember. This too shall pass.

BIB:
(BEAT) Rebecca divorced you and moved to Jersey.

ROLAND:
Ipso Facto, problem solved.

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*the sound of creaking fill the thread*

Quote: Will Cam @ October 6 2010, 3:04 PM BST

Sorry Lee, could you maybe highlight the several gags per page in a colour. I am having trouble finding them.

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BIB:
Clumsiest man I've ever met in my life. Yesterday he slipped on some cooking oil and threw four dozen eggs in the air. urple">It's like being in a silent movie.

ROLAND LAUGHS.

BIB: (CNT'D)
I need help in the kitchen, Roland! Sarah says I'm working too hard.

ROLAND:
How is Sarah?

BIB:
Wouldn't know, would I? Barely see her these days. It's last thing at night and first thing in the morning, just the back of her head resting on the pillow. urple">Might not even be her, she might've escaped! For all I know it could be just cushions and a wig!

ROLAND:
You know me and Rebecca went through a similar thing. Never saw each other, and when we did it was just bicker, bicker, bicker. We became strangers. But you know what? We worked through it, yeah? (HE PLACES HIS HAND WISELY ON BIB'S SHOULDER) Always remember. This too shall pass.

BIB:
urple">(BEAT) Rebecca divorced you and moved to Jersey.

ROLAND:
urple">Ipso Facto, problem solved.

Certainly Will, here you go. Oh you were being sarcastic.

Roland's final response was a gag too.

Oh I see you tried to colour it - ignore me.

Quote: Lee Henman @ October 6 2010, 3:05 PM BST

Actually I thought all the jokes flowed from the characters.

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To me, the characters were all very two-dimensional, their traits and backstories cobbled together just in order to service the weak jokes. The above examples illustrate very well how formulaic the writing is. Lines which are supposed to be witty/illuminative, which are actually divorced from anything a fully-fleshed out character would actually say. They are jokes that work - if they work at all - in complete isolation from character or plot.

They're also simply not very elegant lines. They clunk. And clunky writing makes my ears hurt. A major reason why the lines in shows such as Peep Show, The Office, The Thick Of It, The Inbetweeners work so well is because they are so elegantly written.

Anyway, as you say, just my opinion...

Quote: Marc P @ October 6 2010, 3:11 PM BST

Roland's final response was a gag too.

Oh I see you tried to colour it - ignore me.

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I coloured that one too but it didn't work. Fixed now. Sort of.

Quote: Lee Henman @ October 6 2010, 3:05 PM BST

Anyway, you hate it

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Hate's a bit of a strong word. Life's too short to hate a sitcom. I am, however, completely bemused as to some of the adulation this has received in the press. If viewers enjoy this kind of thing, then fine, but I really don't see it myself.

Quote: Tim Walker @ October 6 2010, 3:17 PM BST

Hate's a bit of a strong word. Life's too short to hate a sitcom. I am, however, completely bemused as to some of the adulation this has received in the press. If viewers enjoy this kind of thing, then fine, but I really don't see it myself.

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But bear in mind 'Downton Abbey's' getting 9 million viwers and that is shit.
I just think the bar's set pretty low these days.
Wierd how it looked better when Lee scripted it out - guess it's down to performance/production then.

Quote: Lazzard @ October 6 2010, 3:52 PM BST

But bear in mind 'Downton Abbey's' getting 9 million viwers and that is shit.

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I am quite enjoying that as well.

Opinion-wise this is shaping up to be the new Grandma's House.

Quote: chipolata @ October 6 2010, 4:24 PM BST

Opinion-wise this is shaping up to be the new Grandma's House.

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Except I can see - if not concur with - the reasons people liked Grandma's House. Whatever one's like/dislike of it, I can see what they were trying to do - i.e. something a little different. I don't see once ounce of the same ambition or originality in Whites, just another very mediocre single-camera sitcom.

But Grandma's House got much much better as it went on, which actually changed, or as im my case, modified viewers' opinions. By the end of the series it was almost a different show to the one that started (in terms of quality), very unusual.

Watched for the first time last night. Wish I hadn't. It wouldn't have been so bad if the director had decided on a style, but we had some actors playing the characters straight and some hamming it up as though they were on Little Britain. It just didn't work for me, though I have to admit I did laugh at one line, the, It's my menu - I thought it was a wizards shopping list, exchange, but that wasn't worth watching the rest of the programme to see.

I enjoyed it again, better than the first episode. Don't get the shoe horning gags thing, seems to flow very nicely to me and it's funny.

Interesting though, reading the comments, most shows seem to either get a strong like or dislike theme running - with the few oddballs of course popping their heads in. But this seems to really have spilt everyone down the middle.

Have drifted off watching the last few episodes, just can't get into it.