I read the news today oh boy! Page 2149

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A Horseradish

  • Sunday 8th March 2020, 5:43pm [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
  • 7,544 posts
Quote: Paul Wimsett @ 8th March 2020, 11:37 AM

I wonder why the Tories want to prevent people getting Coronavirus but don't care about the poor being plunged into poverty? Could it be that Coronavirus also affects the rich?

Good point but of the rich it will principally affect the older or disabled, unemployed/unproductive rich and not so much their younger fit children and grandchildren. In that way, if no other, there, is a parallel between rich and poor. So then it goes back to the question of whether it is just a coincidence that it has happened now or something more sinister. The following points might be of interest, not least to those who in all openness invite oddballs to help them with policy:

Health and Social Care

1. For all of the talk about improving health services and introducing radical improvements to social care, not a lot in the last decade has actually happened there. In fact, the reverse is true. Global cutbacks via austerity. Trump against Medicaid, Medicare or whatever it is the Americans call it. Hardly anything in the Tory manifesto on a new social care system with there having been delays to it throughout Mrs May's time. Much the same has been the case the entire world over.

Private thinking at the senior global Davos level where the likes of Mandelson and Osborne used to frequently rub shoulders with all of the world's bigwigs is almost certainly that better services will never be affordable. Ultimately they view this line as deeply unpopular and worry about its impacts on their order. Consequently a bug which wipes out many of the old and the vulnerable diminishes the prospect of revolutions. They simply say "oh deary me - it is the bug's fault.

Bailouts of Private Businesses

2. Historically, taxpayers via Governments have bailed out failing private companies to protect business people, their employees and in some respects national economies. Only in very recent years has there been an instinct not to do it with a new philosophy that it isn't for the best in cost terms. See for example Flybe. As many companies go to the wall with this bug, the argument will be that they were too weak and that the bug has simply got rid of the dead wood. They can't save everything. It is the perfect excuse for not trying to save anything. Again, survival of the fittest and mightily convenient.

Climate Change

3. Climate change, global warming and modern vibes about the environmental and personal health advantages of radically different diets based less on meat and more on mung beans. The green movement has successfully convinced everyone that governments should do more to protect the planet and it fits in well with cutting healthcare costs if the younger generations eat differently in big numbers and stay healthier. However, people do not practice what they preach.

They still want to travel everywhere by plane or train. They still want to have six pints of beer every night and eat chocolate. This was always going to be the case forever more. Governments can't win. Oh, but that was then. Now they say there is a bug which threatens health substantially and it's best that people stay in their houses. Then habits will change in the longer term because people will always remember 2020 and how they didn't feel safe carrying on as they were.

The Planet Versus Social Services

4. The shrinking of the global economy. Environmentalists have always argued among themselves about if they wanted economic growth via a green economy or less or no growth as all growth is environmentally destructive, In this light, the idea that health and social care can be paid for better than they are today with green radicalism has always sounded at most optimistic. Even unrealistic. Privately many global leaders consider that it is a battle. Environmental protection plus the shrinking of the economy versus economic growth, pollution and better healthcare, welfare, pensions. They have decided the environment and the reverse of growth wins the contest. Only with this bug do they have an excuse to do it.

Competition Between Nations

5. Competition between nations. The problem with that decision is that some countries might do it and some might do the opposite. In that scenario, there would be revolution in the countries where health and welfare are not prioritised with people saying that other countries are providing their people with care. But to have a global bug ensures that all countries will do it. Everywhere the economy shrinks in what is in effect a new survival of the fittest world economic order.

What people have to realise here is that the post war paternalistic order had the pluses of Governments being fatherly in a caring way to their citizens but with the regular dramatic down sides of war created by a sense of "I am a better father of my nation than that bloke is a father to his nation". From a voters' perspective that translated into "my Dad is better than your Dad" which meant they when ordered were prepared to fight wars. In the past few decades all of that was thrown out although it appears to survive in surface tensions. Hyped up spats between Britain and France on fishing or the US and China on trade. The ultimate destination is "no one is a father to citizens but rather the global state is the boss of you all". Whatever the talk of disagreements, that is at the heart of it. It is small wonder that Iranian rulers have been bugged. They are among the few who don't sign up to the pretence that international leaders are in conflict because they genuinely are.

Housing

6. Housing. In countries used to home ownership, the dream of owning a home has increasingly eluded the young, To address it would mean artificially reducing house values dramatically. That would be entirely unacceptable to modest home owners for whom their home is basically their pension. They can release the funds for their own care if needs be but not if the value plummets. They also believe in leaving what they can to their offspring which doesn't address wider issues of young people's housing. A bug kills off many of these people and redistributes the wealth plus it reduces the cost of housing for everyone as the economy crashes. Politicians can say that it was the bug's fault and nothing to do with them while adding that at least more people can buy their own home now and there is less need for house building.

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A Horseradish

  • Sunday 8th March 2020, 6:30pm [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
  • 7,544 posts

Brexit and The Future of the EU

7. Brexit etc. European leaders are livid about Brexit and they will be forever more. They are determined to punish and even put down those who voted for it and indeed all of the nationalists in other parts of Europe who have been encouraged to try for independence. In Britain, it is largely the elderly who voted for it. Consequently they are to have their social systems removed from them. In Italy and other places, it is often rebellious youth which is most anti EU.

It has been decided that those youth movements should be put in their place by a clampdown for now on movement, entertainment, independent political thinking etc. so that they end up despising the notion of independent nations. Here the EU does nothing other than convey it is a kindly and rather uninvolved sort of grandmother. The bug enables all of this bumping off, clampdown and rearranging of public perceptions to be done in a way that the politicians can say was entirely out of their hands. Again, the perfect excuse. Of course, here Trump, Putin and even the Chinese are mavericks themselves but deep down they have a similar fear of independence movements - be they in California or Crimea or Tibet.

Terrorism, Crime and Identity Politics

8. Terrorism. How to maintain an open society and counter terrorist movements? Answer - you try and then decide you can't do it. The bug conveniently arrives to announce "we'd love to keep it all open but sadly for your own benefits there needs to be a total clampdown". All Muslim and other extremists are simply reduced to being among the controlled populace. In fact, even all of identity politics is effectively wiped out as everyone just becomes the same as each other. Controlled. Oh and knife crime and drug dealing plummet. The public concludes it was all an improvement in some ways.

Concluding Points

These are my ideas but, yes, I have concluded that the nut Mr Icke is 75% right. I write here as someone who has always believed in moderating liberalism and liberalising conservatism while having an old fashioned centre position too on money matters. In most things I believe in a balance. Regrettably, I sense that our leaders and even most voters have a strong tendency to be all at one extreme or the other. Consequently the pendulum has sadly now swung to semi-fascism.

Here incidentally is Mr Cummings' paper which was published some years ago in The Guardian. I haven't personally read it in full although I have read several sections. I expect it has quite a lot to say about chaos theory. There is a lot of chaos in that theory but one thing is for sure. When all of the cards of the systems we all recognise and live our lives by are tossed up in the air, they do all ultimately fall back down to settle in a different order. No one senior knows precisely what the new pattern will look like but they have a pretty good idea. Just a reading of a sentence or two of the paper and you may well feel that his paper is not for you. Consequently, I offer a simple guide to approaching it. Type the word "epidemic" in the search engine. Then try to follow what he has to say about the strategic international gaming exercises in that area.

The really huge mistake was the call for what in effect are to the average Joe weirdos to provide inputs into policy making at the senior level. It absolutely let the cat out of the bag about what for a long time has been going on across the globe. For an alternative bit of comparatively light reading, see Dr David Owen's "The Hubris Syndrome". We should have known.

https://dominiccummings.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/20130825-some-thoughts-on-education-and-political-priorities-version-2-final.pdf

www.lorddavidowen.co.uk/hubris-syndrome-an-acquired-personality-disorder-a-study-of-us-presidents-and-uk-prime-ministers-over-the-last-100-years/

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Rood Eye

  • Wednesday 11th March 2020, 12:36pm [Edited]
  • England
  • 4,103 posts

The queen became the longest-reigning British monarch of all time in September 2015.

Today, she became the fourth longest-reigning monarch of all time in the world.

The current league table is:

1. Louis XIV of France (reigned from 14 May 1643 to 1 September 1715)

2. Bhumibol Adulyadej of Thailand (reigned from 9 June 1946 to 13 October 2016)

3. Johann II of Liechtenstein (reigned from 12 November 1858 to 11 February 1929)

4. Queen Elizabeth II (reigned from 6 February 1952)

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A Horseradish

  • Wednesday 11th March 2020, 5:25pm
  • United Kingdom
  • 7,544 posts

Wow.

The UK's first socialist budget since Ted Heath was Prime Minister.

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Billy Bunter

  • Wednesday 11th March 2020, 7:48pm [Edited]
  • The Sussex Coast, England
  • 1,375 posts
Quote: A Horseradish @ 11th March 2020, 5:25 PM

Wow.

The UK's first socialist budget since Ted Heath was Prime Minister.

Yes. And look where that led us: Inflation of over 20%; interest rates of 16%; the three day week; mullets.

On the other hand it did lead to some decent music and some pretty good sitcoms.

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A Horseradish

  • Wednesday 11th March 2020, 9:49pm [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
  • 7,544 posts
Quote: Billy Bunter @ 11th March 2020, 7:48 PM

Yes. And look where that led us: Inflation of over 20%; interest rates of 16%; the three day week; mullets.

On the other hand it did lead to some decent music and some pretty good sitcoms.

Oh but mullets peaked when PInk Maggo was on the throne..........

............then they tailed off in the New Conservatism of Mr Blair.

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Frankie Mildly Perturbed

  • Thursday 12th March 2020, 4:42am [Edited]
  • London, United Kingdom
  • 5,496 posts

Basically, it's back to nature post Covid 19.
That's ok, in nature there is nothing bad happening. In fact there is no concept of bad. In nature there has never been a murder (well, some say chimpanzees may have committed a few...) and no rapes either, so that's a couple of worries gone, well maybe. There is however plenty of confirmed stalking going on, and killing and eating. But that is natural in nature, and after all, natural is best. Plenty of Moms are saying everyday that natural is best, and as we all know, Moms of any gender are always right.

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A Horseradish

  • Thursday 12th March 2020, 11:26am [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
  • 7,544 posts

Live From The Fake News Monitoring Centre

The entire Spanish Government is to be tested for coronavirus following the announcement that the Equalities Minister has tested positive.

She joins the UK's Health Minister who tested positive, half of the Iranian Government who have tested positive, the international political bigwig owner of Olympiacos who has been a Greek MP and friend to senior European politicians - he tested positive, following which many well-known footballers self-isolated.

Plus the highly politically active and friend of leading Democrats, Tom Hanks, and his wife - they have tested positive; and David Sassoli, the President of the European Parliament, who hasn't tested positive but made a special journey through Brussels on crowded public transport to a fully staffed EU building to make a video - one in which he announced he was self-isolating as a precautionary measure. Then he went back home again.

Statistically the chances of so many famous names already being struck down in this way is millions and millions to one unless (A) the overall statistics are wrong or (B) for genetic reasons, the virus is most easily caught by powerful public figures who lie to lead we billions of run-of-the-mill little people by example.

And If it is B, maybe it's mainly a fake live lizard eating thing?

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Paul Wimsett

  • Thursday 12th March 2020, 11:33am
  • Folkestone, United Kingdom
  • 3,392 posts

Maybe if they got rid of these doctors from TV studios it wouldn't spread as fast?

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A Horseradish

  • Thursday 12th March 2020, 11:48am [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
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Quote: Paul Wimsett @ 12th March 2020, 11:33 AM

Maybe if they got rid of these doctors from TV studios it wouldn't spread as fast?

A very good point.

Place your bets on which famous names are going to declare next?

Evens - A member of the Royal Family - probably Prince Andrew
2-1 - Philip Schofield
3-1 - Tyson Fury
4-1 - The Archbishop of Canterbury
6-1 - Angela Merkel
8-1 - Dilyn, the dog of Boris Johnson and Carrie Symonds

10-1 - Kristalina Georgieva, Head of the International Monetary Fund
12-1 - Pele
16-1 - Julian Assange
25-1 - Alex Salmond
33-1 - Adele
50-1 - Elvis who is discovered to be alive after all in an old folk's home south of Memphis

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Briosaid

  • Thursday 12th March 2020, 11:53am
  • 1,356 posts

Managed to see a GP today in the nick of time as she told me that, as of noon, all pre-booked appointments will be cancelled and the phone will be used instead.

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A Horseradish

  • Thursday 12th March 2020, 1:30pm [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
  • 7,544 posts
Quote: Briosaid @ 12th March 2020, 11:53 AM

Managed to see a GP today in the nick of time as she told me that, as of noon, all pre-booked appointments will be cancelled and the phone will be used instead.

Congratulations although it is also easy to see the potential down side.

I expect that in the next few days we shall here that anyone who managed to get to their surgery in the nick of time will be required to spend the next 14 in isolation.

Any rebellion from the elderly over 28s and those energy smart meters will not only immediately be made compulsory but will come fitted with a Big Brother camera.

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A Horseradish

  • Friday 13th March 2020, 5:15am [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
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So if you stuck your money instead on the wife of Justin Trudeau testing positive and the Canadian leader himself self-isolating you are now quids in. Ditto Arsenal manager, Mikel Arteta, and young Chelsea starlet, Callum Hudson-Odoi.

The Trudeau "coincidence" is basically the latest part of the global roll-out of "it can happen to your politicians too". Two days ago Britain, Yesterday Spain. Today Canada. Tomorrow somewhere else but not among US Presidential candidates or in Russia. Expect Putin 67, Trump 73, Biden 77 and Sanders 78 all to be declared fighting fit for the whole of this year.

Arteta is essentially the ratcheted up senior wing of an Arsenal team which was already in self-isolation (although all have now tested negative). In fact his condition and their close shave, now clarified, represents a switch to a message that this has become more important than just everyday players. It is so important it is at football manager level. Arsenal have from the outset been the leading official reflection in football on these things. Well, historically their establishment credentials were always impeccable so that arrangement shouldn't come as any surprise. All the past Eton connections and the like.

Timing wise, the Arteta business coincides with the Government's surprise decision to allow sporting events to take place. That left the Premier League in a quandary as they couldn't blame Johnson when everything went pear shaped. It logically follows therefore that they may well have had concerns that the clubs rather than the Government would have to take financial and other responsibility for people falling ill in their stadiums. Brighton v Arsenal is now off. Expect other games to be off before midday, just as the Government hoped they would be once it chose distance from the final decision.

Hudson-Odoi is more difficult to read but he is a popular figure among young people and arguably black British youth in particular. They will have seen most of the fallen to date as being just the elites and also mainly white. So my reading there is a "don't think you can relax either, however young and fit you are." It's quite fascinating actually to see which names are arising in what seems to be a series of individual incidents but could arguably be connected as "duty in national interests."

For whatever the truths or lies in any of it, and in some cases I am not wholly convinced, it cannot be denied that those involved in any strategy would be trying - and even going out of their way - to do right for "the people" as they see it.

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chipolata

  • Friday 13th March 2020, 6:46am
  • England
  • 30,082 posts

The nut-jobs are revelling in coronavirus, using it prove every one of their crackpot and evidence-free theories. Although I like the idea that the global elite, who are all incredibly old, created a virus that is most dangerous to the very old. Excellent work, very old!

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A Horseradish

  • Friday 13th March 2020, 8:52am [Edited]
  • United Kingdom
  • 7,544 posts
Quote: chipolata @ 13th March 2020, 6:46 AM

The nut-jobs are revelling in coronavirus, using it prove every one of their crackpot and evidence-free theories. Although I like the idea that the global elite, who are all incredibly old, created a virus that is most dangerous to the very old. Excellent work, very old!

I suggest a likely combination of cock up and conspiracy. Boris Johnson says that this is the worst epidemic the UK has faced in a generation. How long is a generation? Certainly not a hundred years. The scientifically labelled Spanish flu of 1918-19 mainly killed young people, no doubt exacerbated by physical deterioration in the war and a lack of an advanced health service, but it wasn't Spanish in origin. It was just noticed first in Europe there. So what does the Prime Minister have in mind? Is 38 years a generation for that was when HIV/AIDS first appeared - or somewhat less than 38 years when that peaked? It is very worth bearing in mind that just as Spanish flu wasn't Spanish, HIV/AIDS was originally given the title GRID (Gay-Related Immune Deficiency) because leading scientists were absolutely convinced that it only affected gay men. In this light, while Coronavirus would logically mostly affect the vulnerable and vulnerable elderly, that may well turn out to be as much bunk as the two precedents I have cited. The common theme is that the scientists have been wrong.

Meanwhile, Talksport are regularly interviewing a leading pandemic expert, Dr Dena Grayson, who claims that a second worse wave will hit us in the winter once it has settled in the hitherto comparatively unaffected southern hemisphere. That contradicts almost everything our scientists have said about flu tending to have a second wave and coronaviruses not so. In part contrast to the generational point of Johnson and his science team - only part as she is talking globally - she added that it is the worst of its kind since Spanish flu. She was also very scornful of Trump's response. But in the interview I heard, the radio station didn't mention that she has stood for very high office as a Democrat and that since 2016 she has been married to Democrat Congressman Alan Grayson. The latter just three months ago released a book titled "High Crimes: The Impeachment of Donald Trump". So it would be naïve to think that quite a lot of what is being done is entirely without any political angle even where it is implied in the presentation that it is pure scientific judgement and nothing else.