Quote: Aaron @ 24th February 2017, 8:25 PM

He's probably referring to the whole thing hinging on Glenister's character suddenly trying to intervene and take the knife from them during the struggle, leading to the accidental slashing of the throat (and Glenister's character not feeling the lack of contact between the knife and the neck).

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Of course, as they let go to allow him to yank away the knife violently and the "waitress" stood nearby, there was always a risk that he'd *actually* stab her.

Also, unless his trade deals are definitely very dodgy (did I miss stronger allusions to this?), I think the vast majority of peple would still call the police, not spend £200K covering it up..

Probably the knife was a dud anyway.

Quote: Chappers @ 26th February 2017, 10:51 PM

Probably the knife was a dud anyway.

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What you mean it wasn't loaded?

If it was the same knife Reece's character used on his own fingers, then it was real.

Quote: Hercules Grytpype Thynne @ 21st February 2017, 11:14 PM

One big hole in the plot, otherwise quite enjoyable and funny in parts.

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There are no such things as plot holes!

Quote: Charlie Boy @ 27th February 2017, 12:36 PM

There are no such things as plot holes!

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!

Where Suspension of Disbelief Comes to Die....................

In fiction, a plot hole, plothole or plot error is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot. Such inconsistencies include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline.

Quote: Charlie Boy @ 27th February 2017, 12:36 PM

There are no such things as plot holes!

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Are you serious?

The knife-swipe thing was an enormous plot hole.

Does anybody have any theories about what leverage they had over Craig to rope him into joining the next scam? I suppose they could have threatened to kill him but they all put so much effort into avoiding actually having to kill anyone in their scam so that seems unlikely to me. My only other guesses are that they found out what was in his top drawer and the right side of his wardrobe and used whatever twisted thing that was against him, or that maybe he joined without too much fuss because he's a thrill seeker and as sleazy as they are.

I thought it was a brilliant episode though. Really well done. I'm willing to write off the improbability of the throat cutting thing considering the characters openly acknowledge that their plot was too elaborate. The characters had obviously scripted and staged the whole thing pretty thoroughly almost like a mini play given that they recycle the same exact lines in the next round of the scam at the end and what with Ellie White's character having the fake blood rigged to her arm. When they are bickering about Ellie's character going too far with her accent and Ellie calling them out on using Reece's characters wife's real name when they had agreed they wouldn't use real names and the comment about how the scam failing came down basically to being a matter of bad staging. The characters putting on the act could get their "stage directions" right so that Ellie would be standing in just the right spot for Craig to swing the knife at her when Reece intentionally stabs his fingers. But since Craig wasn't in on the act he had no stage directions to follow and "missed his mark" so to speak, by stepping on her hand and that's where the plan fell apart. I'm probably overthinking it and I'm not sure any of what I just said makes any sense. But I think the pieces fit together well enough, plotholes or not.

Really looking forward to tomorrow's episode!

"Ellie would be standing in just the right spot for Craig to swing the knife at her when Reece intentionally stabs his fingers."

And that's where it fell down. As I said at the start of this, too much of a long shot that he should grab the knife and make such a performance of swinging it away like that - and so as I also said, a big hole in the plot.

Quote: Charlie Boy @ 27th February 2017, 12:36 PM

There are no such things as plot holes!

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Have you never seen Sherlock?

Oh, and btw I enjoyed this episode...

Back on track tonight, and being a cryptic crossword fan.......................

(SPOILERS FOR EPISODE 3 CONTAINED)

Does the clue for 3 down actually work? I'm confused as to why the 'n' in the anagram of 'sphynx' is moved to the end of the word and why the order of the letters of 'iota' are mixed up.

I think it's really cool that Steve Pemberton wrote the crossword used in the episode and that it actually appeared in today's issue of The Guardian under the 'Sphynx' pseudonym.

I'm still trying to work out some of the links between Oedipus and the episode. In the greek tragedy (fitting because Steve's character teaches classics), Laius, the king of Thebes (the city guarded by the Sphynx) receives a prophecy that his son will kill him, so he hobbles his son and leaves him to die when he's just a baby to stop the prophecy coming true. A shepherd finds the son, and brings him to a neighboring king, Polybus, who raises Oedipus as his own. Oedipus receives a prophecy that he will kill his father and marry his mother. He wants to stop his prophecy from coming true as well, so he leaves Polybus and his wife and heads to Thebes where he solves the Sphynx's riddle, wins kingship over the city, kill's Laius (his real father), and marries Laius' wife Jocasta (his real mother), fulfilling the prophecy. So we've got themes of incest, cannibalism, revenge, asphyxiation, and characters killing themselves out of shame, which all tie into both stories. What I'm having trouble working out is which characters within the episode mirror which characters in the play, and who really kills who, in the end? Reece's character seems like he must be Polybus, since he raised the children as his own. Simon, the son, could be the Oedipus character, as he was trying to win the love of his mother by defeating his father (though he doesn't know he's his father) in the crossword competition. But I'm having trouble with Steve's character and the girl. Steve could be Laius, but also the Sphynx, and my only guess for the girl is maybe Chrysippus. The roles and relationships between the characters seem mixed up and rearranged from the original tragedy though, which I suppose could make sense if you interpret the word 'characters' as in 'letters' of a word and also characters in the story, which can be rearranged in an anagram to form a new word/story, fitting in with the cryptic crossword theme of the episode. If that makes any sense. I can never tell whether I'm over or underthinking Inside no 9 episodes. Maybe both. In any case, I love this episode! Definitely one of my favorites overall.

Quote: Davida Grimes @ 1st March 2017, 3:13 AM

(SPOILERS FOR EPISODE 3 CONTAINED)

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"Does the clue for 3 down actually work? I'm confused as to why the 'n' in the anagram of 'sphynx' is moved to the end of the word and why the order of the letters of 'iota' are mixed up". - It doesn't help that you have spelt sphinx wrong (oddly, you can have a sphynx cat) leaving you an "I" short. So:-

A SPHYXI ATIO N

"The roles and relationships between the characters seem mixed up and rearranged from the original tragedy though, which I suppose could make sense if you interpret the word 'characters' as in 'letters' of a word and also characters in the story, which can be rearranged in an anagram to form a new word/story, fitting in with the cryptic crossword theme of the episode. If that makes any sense. I can never tell"

And there you have answered you own query. I think it was a very clever plot all round, including I believe a political message right at the end.

Jesus Christ, that plot! Never was good at cryptic crosswords anyway so I was down from the off, but arguably one of the cleverest plots they're done (I love that credited is a Crossword Consultant) I'll have to watch it again to be honest, though I did love the whole Chekov's gun thing, can they do any more to prove their worth as writers!

Quote: Hercules Grytpype Thynne @ 1st March 2017, 9:32 AM

I think it was a very clever plot all round, including I believe a political message right at the end.

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If you read this article/interview with Steve by the episode's crossword consultant, he explicitly states that it was a nice coincidence they jumped on, not a political message.

https://www.theguardian.com/crosswords/crossword-blog/2017/feb/28/riddle-of-the-sphinx-guardian-cryptic-crossword-inside-no-9