Quote: Renegade Carpark @ June 14 2012, 9:46 PM BSTIndeed. I hope the England players watched that match and learned that you need to pressure the Spics when they've got possession and not back off and ball watch.
Did you miss the score?
I hope England don't get Spain. I have heard enough about Chelsea-Barca to last me a lifetime. Every team that plays even slightly defensively is compared to 10 men-behind-the-ball Chelsea.
Quote: Jamey @ June 14 2012, 10:25 PM BSTI have heard enough about Chelsea-Barca to last me a lifetime. Every team that plays even slightly defensively is compared to 10 men-behind-the-ball Chelsea.
F**k yes. And sometimes in a non-derogatory way! Cor, I remember the days when there were eleven strikers on the pitch, what a good thing Chelsea came along and demonstrated an alternative tactic.
Quote: Jamey @ June 14 2012, 10:25 PM BSTDid you miss the score?
Nope, along with the possession, the positioning and passing to feet, which allowed the Spaniards to score 4 goals.
However, when Ireland did step it up and attacked the Spanish, they lost their composure and it was only some shoddy passing / shooting that stopped the Paddys from scoring.
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ June 14 2012, 10:35 PM BSTNope, along with the possession, the positioning and passing to feet, which allowed the Spaniards to score 4 goals.
However, when Ireland did step it up and attacked the Spanish, they lost their composure and it was only some shoddy passing / shooting that stopped the Paddys from scoring.
There are already rumors of Parker and Gerrard's fitness not being up too the Euro's close fixtures, they are both passionate engines who run all day, but it's the end of a long Premier league season, they have both had more than a few injuries and if you try to race the ball you will always come off second. At least if England sit back they will have the energy to break when they do get the ball.
Maybe not parking the bus but a realistic stance on defence. If the break isn't on they can always try and keep the ball, make coax Spain towards the ball and get Young or Gerrard to put a ball behind them for a runner.
Quote: Jamey @ June 14 2012, 11:58 PM BSTAt least if England sit back they will have the energy to break when they do get the ball.
Maybe not parking the bus but a realistic stance on defence. If the break isn't on they can always try and keep the ball, make coax Spain towards the ball and get Young or Gerrard to put a ball behind them for a runner.
I can totally understand where you are coming from and I think that is how Hodgson will set it up, but...as a team England aren't a unit, unlike the Spanish who seem to know where each of their players are at any given time. Their one touch passing has destroyed defences far stronger then England's - and we've got a damn good one.
All it takes is one slip on the pitch or a bad back pass and they're in and we're chasing the game - which means breaking up the 10 men behind the ball game plan and Spain further exploiting gaps in our defence.
Put on an aggressive midfield that will shut their players down - as an Arsenal fan, I've seen clubs lower down the table do that to us and it has been incredibly successful. Don't give them time to think, break up their rhythm and dictate the pace. If we allow them to have any significant possession, then we're doomed.
IMHO.
This is always assuming that England get into the knockout stage . . .
Quote: Oldrocker @ June 15 2012, 12:21 AM BSTThis is always assuming that England get into the knockout stage . . .
Come on Oldrocker, you know as well as I do that we're going to get through thanks to some weird results in our group and after the points are tallied up, we're in the next round.
It has to happen this way, so for a few brief days, we can actually believe we're going to win it and get all excited. Then when we under perform and get beat worse then the Irish, we can all enjoy that collective kick in the nuts that we all crave.
Best odds on England winning the whole thing are 12 and half to 1 with Bwin.
I reckon you've got enough time to re mortgage your property (plenty of takers on the lesser known TV channels adverts) and early retirement beckons !
In fact on July 1 you could be popping your cork !
Go on. Go for it.
You know it makes sense !
Quote: Nil Putters @ June 14 2012, 9:25 PM BSTSome fantastic football from the Spaniards.
Yes, but mainly because it was against Ireland. I don't think we'll be seeing quite such indulgent ball hogging and pass pass pass pass pass pass football against Germany or France or Italy or whoever else gets to play them in the knockouts.
And no offence to their followers here but I wish Ireland would stop bothering to enter these contests. It is a waste of time and effort for everyone and a waste of a place for a much better footballing nation like Romania or Hungary, who've always played attractive football. Ireland offer the football loving neutral nothing but grimaces.
And they offer top teams like Spain a golden chance to sharpen their skills and get vital goal scoring practice. Let's just hope they don't qualify for the World Cup in ihe home of 'the beautiful game'. It would just be wrong for Ireland to be there. They have only one way of playing for every contest and every era and every coach, and that is DIRE.
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ June 15 2012, 12:49 AM BSTAnd no offence to their followers here but I wish Ireland would stop bothering to enter these contests.
They didn't go to Euro 2012 by winning a sodding Wonka Golden Ticket. There are these things called qualifiers, where teams such as Romania and Hungary play other teams and the best ones go through to the Euro Finals.
I suppose you would like to see all teams who never win it not enter - such as Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and of course, England. The best we've ever done is get to the semi-finals and that's when we hosted the bloody thing in 1996.
Luckily for you, Spain were always brilliant, qualified for every single Euro Championship and won it each time - or did they start off as quite a small footballing nation, worked on their team and their league and eventually became a great footballing nation? I forget.
Anyway, what are you complaining about, they play football the way you like it, with lots of long balls and kicking other players. I thought you'd be happy to see this instead of that useless tikka takka namby pamby skillful football.
Rant over. (don't worry Alfred, I still think you are a good egg, just a little misguided)
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ June 15 2012, 12:14 AM BSTAll it takes is one slip on the pitch or a bad back pass and they're in and we're chasing the game - which means breaking up the 10 men behind the ball game plan and Spain further exploiting gaps in our defence.
Put on an aggressive midfield that will shut their players down - as an Arsenal fan, I've seen clubs lower down the table do that to us and it has been incredibly successful. Don't give them time to think, break up their rhythm and dictate the pace. If we allow them to have any significant possession, then we're doomed.
IMHO.
You are right about the mistake, but a mistake could just as easily come from Spain breaking through a gap made by out of position players hunting down the ball.
I defiantly wouldn't object to your idea as much if we had more cover available but the thing that worries me is Henderson waiting on the sideline for when one of Parker or Gerrard inevitably pull up chasing down a ball for the thousandth time in the sixtieth minute.
Ireland started bright out of the box thinking they could close down the ball but they gave up several times just letting Spain play around them until they gathered up enough energy and will to chase it down again, they knew this was their last hurrah and they gave it everything reaching the knockouts would be a final for them and they needed to give it their all. England will go in knowing that should they win they only have six days until the semis followed by 3 days till the final (they should be so lucky) it just doesn't make sense in this kind of tourney with the aged players of England to go at Spain like madmen.
Quote: Jamey @ June 15 2012, 1:13 AM BSTit just doesn't make sense in this kind of tourney with the aged players of England to go at Spain like madmen.
It makes perfect sense, as it's the only way to beat them. Unlike Germany who move as one fluid machine, England are a hodge podge of 'stars' who haven't played together as a team for any significant amount of time.
We sat back and rode our luck against the French in our first game and could have easily lost it if the Frogs were as cohesive as the Spanish or the Italians.
Crossing your fingers and hoping England are lucky enough to get through is a game plan, but not one I subscribe too.
EDIT: As for Scott Parker, I wish we left him at home. He's terrible.
EDIT 2: Ireland only got back in the game in the second half when the Spaniards began to tire. But by then, they'd already done the damage and the Paddys were demoralised.
I guess we both have our views, maybe a combination could be employed.How did England do it last time when they beat Spain? I never saw it?
I am supporting the Italians for the Euros.
I love good football, but like it played with a bit of spirit too, and think tackling and a bit of contact is fine. Seeing it refined down to passy passy showboating is NOT my idea of great football and the greatest teams like 1970 Brazil or 74 W Germany did not do this. Spain do it and I am sick of them. I criticise Wenger's Arsenal for trying to mimic Barcelona, the heart of Spain for playing this way too.
Yes Ireland qualified, in their usual bludgeoning way, and the luckless Romania get a genuinely tough group, try to football their way through it and get nowhere! Doesn't seem right to me 
And you and me are paying for another futile and unattractive Ireland campaign/excuse for a mass Paddies' pissup.
Anyone else watching Ukraine-France? (Or not watching it I should say) Amazing weather, the lightning during the French national anthem was hilarious.
Also Tymoshchuk called Ribery a wanker in the tunnel before kick off.